Episode 138

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Published on:

11th Sep 2025

A Sense-Making Odyssey, Part 1: Jordan Peterson, John Vervaeke & Jordan Hall

Join Matt and Chris as they enter an intellectual labyrinth of recursive sensemaking featuring the combined insights of Jordan Peterson, John Vervaeke, and Jordan Hall. You will learn about many, many deep and complex concepts and puzzle over definitions of conscience, the vertical hierarchy, value, normativity, goals & ideals, quests, the ultimate unifying meta-narrative, self-sacrifice, and touchstones.

With frequent excursions into a wild assortment of biblical stories, Platonic philosophy, Jungian psychology, Martial Art stances, and much, much more! This is a voyage through the refracted and refracting philosophical frameworks of three contemporary sensemaking powerhouses.

So get your oars ready and prepare your mind to taste the Dialogos, vis-à-vis Moses...

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About the Podcast

Decoding the Gurus
A psychologist and an anthropologist try to make sense of the world's greatest self-declared Gurus.
An exiled Northern Irish anthropologist and a hitchhiking Australian psychologist take a close look at the contemporary crop of 'secular gurus', iconoclasts, and other exiles from the mainstream, offering their own brands of unique takes and special insights.

Leveraging two of the most diverse accents in modern podcasting, Chris and Matt dig deep into the claims, peek behind the psychological curtains, and try to figure out once and for all... What's it all About?

Join us, as we try to puzzle our way through and talk some smart-sounding smack about the intellectual giants of our age, from Jordan Peterson to Robin DiAngelo. Are they revolutionary thinkers or just grifters with delusions of grandeur?

Join us and let's find out!
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About your hosts

Christopher Kavanagh

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A Northern Irish cognitive anthropologist who occasionally moonlights as a social psychologist. Chris has long standing interests in the psychology of conspiracy theorists and pseudoscience. His academic research focuses on the Cognitive Science of Religion and ritual psychology. He lives happily in Japan with his family.

Matthew Browne

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An Australian psychologist and numbers-guy. He does research on all kinds of stuff, but particularly enjoys looking into why people believe the things they do: religion, conspiracy theories, alternative medicine and stuff. He's into social media in the same way people slow down for car accidents.